"American Freedom"

Aragorn wrote:

Nihil wrote:MY POST IS LONG I KNOW :O

No, I mean the post... No one wants to "destroy our democracy" other countries have so many other problems that they have to deal with them first, even before they can take on us.

Also, when we have soldiers fighting the rich man's war for oil? I mean, I sympathize with their loss, but its like asking me to honor Brown Coats.

That is the way I look at it, also, we are not the only country out there, other countries children have been dying out there too. In Nazi Germany, people may have thought they were fighting for an honourable cause, and they may have died in the field, just like these soldiers in Iraq may think that they were fighting for an honourable cause, which is implausible to me after Abu Ghraibe, and they probably were asked to "honour their fallen" too. Look at history: no one honors the Nazis or the Brown Coats, and that is my point.

War is dangerous because of the nationalism it stirs up. Nationalism, should anyone want to know, is a disease, it was almost the sole participant in the lighting up of the Baltics leading to WWI and played a part in the lead up to WWII in Germany and Italy. Heck, even Einstein believes that it was an "infantile disease". I am as quick to bite the military forces of the world as soon as I am to praise them, because, no noble military intention is without damning fault, the fire bombing of Germany comes to mind. Especially in this day and age where we are fighting guerilla wars and not all-out total war. Where we kill tens of thousands of by standers by simply being in a country where there is an ideological wall of separation from a group and an long resentment towards foreign meddling in their domestic policies that is widely expressed.

Let me put it to you this way:

When Timothy McVeigh made his own terrorist attack on the U.S, did we invade ourselves? Lock ourselves down into dictatorship? Suspend Government, Habeas Corpus? No. We recognized that this is a small portion of society that we are forever doomed to encounter, it is such with the war we currently fight, and we only make it worse with our continual presence.

This is war is more about the "lets force our way of life upon everyone else" kind of war.

Call it childish, but I prefer to view today's events in the context and application of history. Gratias Sinas tibi Cicero! Not to know what happened before you were born is to be a child forever. For what is the time of a man, except it be interwoven with that memory of ancient things of a superior age?

Then get the f*ck out of our country. If you do not respect what our troops are doing then gtfo. You don't have to agree with what they're doing but you should have enough respect for the country you live in and the men that are putting their lives on the line so you can sit here and complain about how bad this war is and how bad America is. These soldiers are fighting a war on Terrorism, not oil Nihil. Yes, oil is a factor but it is not the reason we are at war. We're at war to defend the people of America and their freedom. You're sitting here complaining about all this because we have people who care about this country and everyone in it even though they've never met you. How would you feel if you put your life on the line for someone and all they did was complain about it? That's all your doing is saying this is all about oil and how you couldn't support them, merely sympathize because of loss. Any human can sympathize with human loss because it's an emotionally taxing event. I cannot believe you're sitting here ranting about this and saying this is us forcing our way of life on other people when it's the EXACT OPPOSITE. I am so sick and tired of you bashing the country you live in and the people who defend your freedom and liberty.

Nihil wrote:
Did you even read my post??? I answered most of that completely. American Freedom isn't all that unique anymore and this war, if anything has limited my freedoms, my mom is code "purple" and apparently she can't take home stuff from abroad, like Vegas, she has to have it shipped. People have been, without a warrant, wire tapped.

Also, I say what freedom because this war does nothing to preserve or enhance my freedoms.

To reiterate from my last post, Timothy McVeigh, we don't shut down the government from a homegrown terrorist attack, then why do we go to war in another country, have innocents killed so that we can go around with our 1/3 obesity rate and chuck our freedoms around like we are the only one's with them? Some people aren't that fortunate, yes, but do we go to war to solve that problem? NO. Otherwise, other countries who think differently from us would do it, and the entire world would be at war.

The twin towers was a gtfo attack, just like McVeigh's, he wanted the "evil" government out of his life, so he massacred federal employees at a state building with a bomb. My question would be how you could be so ignorant of history, American history for pity's sake.

Ptolemy wrote:...
One thing i have to say is that... there could have been a better way to get to where we wanted to go. after 9-11 there was a tangible desire for revenge and, to tell you the truth, i wrote my congressman several times to get a letter of recommendation to reenter the Army. I wanted to kill some thing. Hunting down the organizations responsible for the attacks of 9-11 and the acts since, i think, could have been handled differently. We were not and are still not well equipped for nation building. How ever, once the decision was made to go to war it should have been sudden, violent and so horrific that no one would want to challenge us in that way again.

It is hard to target their fighting 'men' when they hide amongst their women and children.